WORDS: 2,345 — What qualifies me as an armchair strategist? I spent years in the military carrying a gun and defending my country as an NCO in charge of men and assets. If anyone understands military strategy it’s me. I waited at the phone for the call from any sitting President (or standing one either) to provide my valuable insight, and just crickets. They could have avoided all their troubles. If only they called me first…….
Well.. okay… I embellished just a little (a lot). My military gun-carrying was in guarding airplanes not fighting battles. In fact.. the only military asset I was in charge of was that gun while on duty… oh.. and making sure the nuke in the belly of a couple B-52’s didn’t fall into the hands of those godless Commies. So given I missed out on War College back in the day (wasn’t qualified, wasn’t interested). I pretty much don’t know much about grand military strategies. But I do have a little knowledge to simply “toss it out there” for observation and discussion.
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Back when we did that last hasty departure from a war.. that little 10 year “skirmish” called Vietnam, we left them so much military hardware.. from assault weapons, armor, and lots of choppers, that I recall the talk of the day was that Vietnam was now the region’s third largest and formidable military power.. to China’s presence.. and India at the time. Now.. let’s go a little deeper into that. The NVA was a far more experienced, disciplined, and cohesive fighting force than today’s Taliban. There was some concern that a “recovering” united Communist Vietnam, with a solidly formed government expanding into the south, might just feel like getting a little bit more.. imperial… with all that hardware we left them.. and maybe get belligerent with their neighbors in Laos or Cambodia. To my knowledge nothing major developed… and today they are our trading partner. History creates strange bedfellows for sure. In that war it only took the price of 58,000+ dead Americans (and likely a million others) inside of ten years. Afghanistan, even in spite of the 20 years being there, wasn’t even a “war” by comparison.
The following is from AP, HERE…
American service members killed in Afghanistan through April: 2,448.
U.S. contractors: 3,846.
Afghan national military and police: 66,000.
Other allied service members, including from other NATO member states: 1,144.
Afghan civilians: 47,245.
Taliban and other opposition fighters: 51,191.
Aid workers: 444.
Journalists: 72.
[NOTE: The AP article was dated August 16, and may not include an update to the total to include the 13 American service people killed at Abbey Gate on Aug. 26.]
So it seems compared to Vietnam, Afghanistan wasn’t so bad after all? I’m sure the soldiers serving in Afghanistan would say otherwise. War is war. Also, it is a bit like comparing apples and oranges given our reasons for being at each location was pretty different… and the battle itself, and the “order of battle” was far different. Yet there are very noticeable similarities in that we engaged in nation-building in both places.. and it didn’t take… twice. The jury on our nation-building adventure in Iraq is still out on that. Interestingly, the impetus for going into Iraq and Vietnam was a bit contrived by the respective presidents.
What’s my point in making this comparison? Well, when we are talking about loosing equipment (or “surrendering” equipment if you are making a political argument) to the enemy, what’s important is staying to context. Many of the former South Vietnamese chopper pilots ended up flying themselves and their families out to U.S. ships in the mass exodus two years after our departure… where in turn the U.S. ships had to dump them overboard to keep the decks clear. In many cases, ships with no landing pads had to rescue chopper occupants who simply ditched in the sea next to any ship, knowing they would be rescued. Likely there were not as many surviving choppers in flying condition on land, and certainly few pilots left to fly them. As for the armored vehicles.. you have to have a supply of gas and available parts for maintenance to keep them running. But here’s to the greater question.. which I also pose to our abandonment of military hardware in Afghanistan… so what?
So what??
For starters, to try and find an “unbiased” list of equipment we left behind on the internet is pretty tough. The list below was from a Conservative site. I don’t know how or where they got it, if it’s not contrived for effect. But it suits for our purposes here for discussion. Take a gander of this list.
Here’s another list…
…and yet another list.
Again, I have no idea if this was a current list, some left over delivery manifest from months/years back, the result of some inventory taken for accounting purposes, etc. Some of this seems a bit odd on this list anyway. But let’s say all this is true and accurate. I return to my retort.. so what?
Well, my followup observation would then be… what exactly are they going to do with this stuff even IF it were all operational and available? Let’s do our own rundown of this.
- They certainly aren’t going to attack America with any of this stuff. Assuming they (the Taliban) knew how to operate any of this.. much less use it in a combat strategy of engagement in battle. No Taliban are trained to operate this stuff, much less able to use it as part of fighting in battle as a cohesive unit. They lack fighting discipline. They also lack the ability to plan engagements using this stuff… much less lug it across the world to attack the U.S.
- When our military began arming and training the “new” Afghan military there was certainly thought given to provide only the necessary gear to meet their kind of threat. Meaning, the Pentagon is not going to give any Third World nation technology beyond what is needed to meet their enemy. The Taliban is a conglomerate force, made up of un-disciplined religious zealots from various sources, who’s only strength is short guerilla-style firefights. This does not mean they are to be underestimated, but there is context to what they can do.. and what force is needed to neutralize them. In this case, you meet conventional with conventional.. with maybe a little edge in battlefield tech… like the night vision stuff and recon drones. Is night vision tech and drone tech in Afghanistan going to hurt us here in America? In fact, all that stuff can easily be purchased here on the surplus market. Yes.. for sure some of that, with a little ingenuity, might be able to be smuggled into the states… but even that is a bit of a stretch. That composite explosive stuff, the C-4, Semtex, detonators.. yep… if you can get it into the States as part of a larger plan, that will not be easy… and all that is assuming you are not neutralized before leaving Afghanistan by our intel people.
- As in Vietnam… much of the aircraft needs continued maintenance.. and technical know-how. Those things will not be flying for long, if at all. The aircraft itself is not state-of-the-art In fact… there is not one jet aircraft.. all piston. Those Brazilian Tucano planes (actually designed in Brazil.. made in the U.S.) are piston planes for close-in operations. They will need fuel.
- The Taliban is very likely not to have the time or the inkling to take all that seemingly cool military freebie stuff and invade their neighbors. Why? If they are planning to govern in any way they will be concentrating on security at home from other radical groups like ISIS-K.. and monitoring their own citizens. Also.. the Taliban are not battlefield fighters by experience. In general they are hit and run fighters… and formidable in that capacity.
- They have cool radios! (I’m an old radio guy) Again, so what. They already use ham radio and industrial walkie talkies. They will now have those individual unit radios that they might use for close in support… but again, against whom? What would they be coordinating.. an air and land assault? If they have a functioning airplane and an MRAP do they have an officer corps trained in that kind of strategy? Many of these radios are coded and require actual training to operate. Is there a risk they can lug these things to the States and coordinate nasty missions? Why bother. You can get walkie talkies here.. and military frequencies are many times monitored from government installations.
- Those pallets of money? Let’s go a step further. If the Taliban can’t use all this military stuff they could sure have a big arms bazaar yard sale to grab much more needed cash. Although this stuff is not a big deal to China or Russia, there might be some Third World customers. Will the pallet money (if that’s even true) and yard sale proceeds finance terror in the U,S.? Maybe they might even charge “rent” to all these other extremist groups, like Al Qaeda, that want to seek safe harbor inside Afghanistan. I would think that for a number of years the Taliban are going to need any cash to support their efforts in country. I have faith in our intel to keep track of things. It’s possible that after 20 years of infidel decadence in their country someone might prefer getting a big screen TV rather than spending the cash on terror. Then again.. how much exactly is “millions of dollars on pallets” and how far will it take them?
- Those “captured” U.S. supplied uniforms and personal protection equipment? Other than “looking” like U.S. soldiers (which given this stuff was for the Afghan military, then they would look like U.S. soldiers also), how far is that going to take them other than a few PR/propaganda photos? One might be able to presume that personal unit patching and labeling on these uniforms was not U.S. Where’s the threat here?
- And all those assault rifles? A threat to the U.S.? If the Taliban has 5,000 guys and now 50,000 new assault rifles… they still only have 5,000 guys to carry them. More rifles doesn’t mean a bigger army. These are destined likely for the big yard sale. There’s this moral imposition that suggests these American-made weapons will kill Americans in some future war somewhere. That is very true…. and has been true since we started exporting weapons for profit and political influence early in the last century. It’s even more true when American-made weapons kill Americans here at home. Seems like you should get over it… or stop it everywhere.
- Fellow blogger, “Constitutional Insurgent” on his blog, Libertas and Latte, posted his summations that much of this military equipment very likely could be de-classified and/or obsolete versions for export, or equipment from other countries of origin even though Americans handed it over to the Afghans. He states, “This equipment, again over the past almost 2 decades, has been Divested through the Foreign Military Sales Program [which ensures that only our export models of equipment is eligible]. The equipment left behind, for the most part anyway, was divested to the ANSF. We no doubt left some ancillary gear when we withdrew from various Forward Operating Bases and Bagram…nothing of great import.”
Why Didn’t We Destroy This Equipment When We Had The Chance?
There’s been suggestions that the military failed to destroy this stuff… on the other hand, I’ve read stories that some of this was indeed made… “demilitarized”. Early reports told of drone strikes on locations known to be staging areas or warehouses. I’ve no idea if that is fact. But what is fact… Centcom Commander Gen. Kenneth McKenzie. the fellow who announced the end of the airlift in that Pentagon news conference, stated the following was destroyed at the airport upon departure…
- A C-Ram “Centurion” Vulcan 20mm cannon anti-missile system (the one that took out missiles from that earlier attack)
- 70 MRAP’s (armored vehicles)
- 27 Humvees
- 73 Aircraft
My perception is that sticking around to destroy all this stuff wasn’t worth the risk to American lives.. even before the airlift started. Why would have this equipment been destroyed when we fully expected the Afghan military would use it? They collapsed so quickly resulting in other threats to lives, and the airlift exodus suddenly took precedent. Makes sense to me.
But Maybe……..
There is one last thing I’d like to interject in all this regarding this “danger to America” in having “surrendered” all this stuff to the Taliban. Take heed on this.
Some of this military equipment could prove a valuable asset to the “terrorist” group with the tenacity to want to maintain security and actually govern… the Taliban or anyone else. Most certainly a lot of this stuff requires training to operate, and training to use. Who ever will be forming a government will have to train a police/security force of some kind and the equipment might help to restore order and keep a level of peace. I might also suggest that it’s very likely the individual Taliban fighter will now be shifting his incentive… his willingness.. to fight and die. During this war he was fighting the Western infidels in a jihad/holy war and they fought with the hope to die with promises of eternal lives with virgins , or beans, or whatever makes sense to these people. They won by default.. but a win is a win. They are back in-charge. Their enemy now is another bunch of “fellow” Afghan Islamic extremists. I would guess the average Taliban fighter is now thinking of settling down and looking forward to living a life of being worshipped as a hero of some sort. Obviously I know nothing of Afghan life nor how they think so I could be very wrong here.
The Bottom Line Here….
My personal opinion, there are far more important things to worry about in this country right about now. Of course, if your goal is to just to add something to your political hate-Biden list… that’s up to you in the energy you want to expend on that.
A Recent Update: Check out this FactCheck.org review posted 9/3/21 on exactly everything I have mentioned here.. and more. HERE.
Good post. A couple of things to add; the Taliban are of no threat to U.S. national security, period. They may again [at their peril] host an transnational terrorist organization again…with the predictable results to their own health and well being…..but the Taliban have no designs outside of their own borders.
Folks who think we should have “blown it all up” before we left [including a certain former POTUS], forget that what’s left of this equipment to begin with, has been scattered all over the breadth of Afghanistan. These pretend military wizards imply that we have the entirety of our divested equipment sitting in a warehouse, waiting to be kissed by JDAMs.
It’s all part of a political; narrative. And what’s worse….when this specious rhetorical currency is trafficked by elected representatives and others who actually know better…..they do so because they think that you’re stupid.
It’s frustrating all around. What gets me are some of the Conservative blogs are yakking yet again about some civil war.. and they actually think they are going to “restore” their freedoms. Good lord.
If you care to explore…
https://statelymcdanielmanor.wordpress.com/2021/09/03/the-second-civil-war-25-bad-will-is-cumulative/
I’ve followed this fellow for the last four years.. and he represents the hard line Trumpian base. I comment.. but on that blog I am the sole voice of reason. Although they wouldn’t think so. 🙂
Doug,
You missed the main point the US military equipment managed to be left behind.
It was because Biden believed that it would be used by the 300 000 Afghanistan’s the USA military trained to be used to fight and defend Afghanistan for their freedom.
Obviously, Biden was so ill informed and inept in his role of leader to be made aware that training Afghanistan’s to believe in fighting for Democracy was something worth fighting for. Obviously, most of them never believed any of it and only joined because they would be paid by US taxpayers funds.
Just one more example of the disconnect of Biden and his choices of politicians and military managers to inform him the reality of how hopeless it is for the USA to attempt to Nation build after invading a Nation with a culture who have no concept of what Democracy is all about based on the hopes and dreams of American founders.
(Kind of like what Biden missed out to in my opinion.)
As for your belief that the 80 billion dollars in weapons won’t be used by terrorists, I hope and pray I won’t have to remind you when we read future news about terrorism growth in the Mid-West because of terrorist use of the abandoned USA military equipment giving them the advantage over anyone who does not agree with their opinions.
Or how gangs in the USA terrorize their communities with illegal guns obtained and in gangs and criminals’ possession. (Who knows, if the Taliban is going to obtain needed revenues by selling the abandoned equipment)
As someone who served in the military, how would you like to have been one of the Russian soldiers who in WWII hand to be second to charge the Nazi without a weapon and were toddle to just pick up the weapons from the dead Russian soldiers sent in the first wave?
Sad.
Regards and goodwill blogging.
$80b worth of military equipment didn’t even exist. That was the aggregate amount over 20 years. The repeated use of that number is specious.
Rudy.. I’m impressed that you did indeed focus on the idea that the main point IS the equipment was left for use by the Afghan military.. who took off for the hills. You want to pass that on to the Trump Conservatives who want to blame Biden for leaving it all there for the Taliban? As if there was time… duh.
And CI is correct… all those lists and that 80 billion number were very likely over the last 20 years.. not a month ago.
Doug,
The conservative knew and warned Biden, but he did not listen to the warnings because of his vain belief that anything Trump was associated and succeeded in had to be reversed by the omnipotent logic of the Liberals.
Sad
Regards and goodwill blogging.
Ugh.. if you say so. Although I don’t find Liberals omnipotent and certainly not Trumpian Conservatives. Somewhere in between perhaps.
I believe that the equipment maybe not all was ‘demilitarized’…that means probably thermites were used to make some or all ineffective….if they did not then that is failure by the command structure…..chuq
Yes.. and I would agree. Which would then in effect give them quite a large junk yard.. and metal salvage operation.
GOP is trying to use this issue for political gain….anyone that served will kj0ow the procedure for ‘bugging out’…..spin is all they have. chuq
Oh for sure this is all lumped onto the “hate Biden” bandwagon. It’s got to be kept alive to win seats in 2022.
Doug, – you stated
“It’s got to be kept alive to win seats in 2022.”
Wise observation on both your part and the Conservatives to emulate what the Dems did during the entire four years by of attempting to prosecute and impeach Trump’s during his term in office.
It worked and if something works regards of how wise or foolish, politicians will do it to get reelected in my opinion.
That is because we voters allowed them to finagle to obtain one of the best paying, benefit loaded “gig: to avoid working hard like we simple minded folks.
The politicians just won’t let us impose term limits, which for some reason they voted to be a requirement for the Presidents only??????
Kinda hypocritical perhaps?????
Regards and goodwill blogging.
.
Honestly, I am far less concerned about term limits as much as I am concerned about the quality of effort a serving elected official serve for a single term. Early in my business career I entertained a run for a local office.. and maybe upward from there. I settled for a different road in life. But had I gotten to a state or federal level I would have made a huge effort to simple be known.. and not just taking a seat. Example… not too long ago I had to look up my representative to Congress because I had no idea who he/she was. Turned out being some guy named Obernolte. Huh? Who’s he? Now.. look at Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.. same level of congressperson. She’s got complete national notoriety and my guy does not. Why is that? Oh sure.. she has an edge because she represents an urban area of New York’s 14th District where “my guy” represents mostly rural cacti and scorpions. My point.. if one is going through the effort to serve in politics then make yourself known. Use the damn press.. be vocal about things… develop your name as a tool to enhance servicing your constituents.
Term limits at that level don’t bother me so much,,, although an age limit might.
Doug, fair point on term limits….but a huge part of the problem in our political landscape [aside from the damaging effects of the Duopoly itself], is that we have a career political class. By default, whether as an individual or their party, the overriding weight of effort is going to be spent not toward the good of the Republic….but on the growth or maintenance of the party and it’s members.
Term limits might not be much of a salve, but it certainly couldn’t hurt. Especially when a particular party likes to brand itself in the image of the Founders [and festooned with accoutrements and regalia]….they conveniently ignore what those Founders would think of their tenured fraternity.
I like your point as well and it bears some additional thought. What you are suggesting is that politics itself is an “industry” of and by itself. Given that one can easily assume that like all other endeavors of man it’s the senior members that tend to control things on the inside. Obviously term limits on specific elected positions. or even age limits on those persons who seem to hop from one elected/appointed position to another.. would serve to temper that influence.
To your last paragraph… yeah, it’s bothered me immensely that you can spot/stereotype/readily identify members of “that” party by their flying of the American flag.. and it’s become their standard/icon… but there’s not a damn thing you can do about it… and I become reluctant to display the flag myself for fear I’d be associated with “them”. (the pickup truck driving through the neighborhood with the oversized flag mounted in the back bed or the bumper, is a typical example)
Oh, it’s absolutely an industry…much like the racism racket on the Left.
I feel you on the iconology. As a long-time Libertarian, the Gadsden flag was a sort of banner. Then the Tea Party emerged [acting for convenience sake, like their grievances began when Obama took office]…..and I felt I had to disassociate myself from the symbol. But I consistently fly the Betsey Ross flag on my home.
I have made it a personal mission to retake Patriotism and it’s originalist symbology from those who would pervert it. If you’ve ever been witness to a…*sigh*…”trump train” cavorting through your community….count yourself lucky.
Yeah.. the idea that “patriotism” itself is somehow a virtue of one party nags at my craw. But here’s to the broader picture of that… our problem is not how one side or the other defines patriotism for itself… but rather the faith we have in the Constitution.. which few in America have right now. Most are too busy interpreting it their own way and pointing out the violators, rather than just plain living by it. The Constitution protects US.. we are NOT the guardians of it. If we follow it… then we are keeping it alive to do its job.
Ah, but the Constitution is the enemy of political expediency……
@Doug
Glad I don’t have to count on a Liberal Democrat to protect my back. My guardian angel does a much better job. All you would do is make excuses for that traitorous rat in the White House.
The equipment is a side issue. The reason people mention it is because when Biden abandoned Americans, the Afghans who supported us, the Christians, and Afghan military; Biden left the Afghan military demoralized. Thus, he left the Taliban with the arms they need to secure their hold on the country and to export terrorism.
The problem isn’t the fact Biden pulled out out of Afghanistan. The problem is how he pulled out. Biden pulled the rug out from under all those people. He pulled out our military even before he evacuated our civilians. He made us dependent upon the good graces of a bunch of savages who despise us. And he set us up by lying and saying the Afghan government was more stable than it was.
And you are making excuses for that. What is wrong with you?
And what of the American Citizens who ignored and disregarded State Department warnings over the course of this entire year, to leave Afghanistan? Biden certainly holds the responsibility [even though most decisions were delegated authority, as they always are] for the act of withdrawal itself. But big boy rules also apply here.
Biden lied about the state of the Afghan government? That’s SOP. And irrelevant. Our own politicians lie to us about the state of OUR government….daily.
I’m bemused by the selective and casual use of labels such as ‘traitor’. like most employment of specific words as pejoratives….it only serves to cheapen the word and the speaker.
@Constitutional Insurgent
I have not used the word “traitor” without regard to what that word means. I am not the former head of the CIA, John Brennan.
You have just given an example of Biden’s hypocrisy. You just illustrated that the man is a liar. Nothing that the Biden’s administration says should be trusted without verification. Nothing.
We know Biden needs to be investigated for taking money from foreign entities. That includes the Chinese. Biden just dumped Afghanistan almost irretrievably into the Chinese Communist Party’s sphere of influence.
You’ve described every Administration. Why do you not hold them equally accountable? (Other than being enslaved to the partisan narrative that is)
The alleged dumping of AFG to the Chinese…..pales in comparison to the fact that we followed ObL’s very explicit strategy of becoming mired in the Middle East. Seems traitorous to me……
@Constitutional Insurgent
I have not used the word “traitor” without regard to what it means. I am not the former head of the CIA, John Brennan.
You have just given an example of Biden’s hypocrisy. You just illustrated that the man is a liar. He has even got you talking out of both sides of your mouth. While State Department is issuing warnings, Biden is lying and saying everything is okay?
We know Biden needs to be investigated for taking money from foreign entities. That includes the Chinese. If you think it is an accident that Biden just dumped Afghanistan almost irretrievably into the Chinese Communist Party’s sphere of influence, you are incredibly naïve.
Did you care when Bush lied about the Iraq surge?
Or are you a hypocrite?
@Constitutional Insurgent
Hypocrite! No. I am a sinner, but I don’t pretend to be unbiased. I don’t pretend that the choice to go into Afghanistan did not involve both the good intentions and the greedy designs of government contractors. I don’t pretend that staying in Afghanistan involved tradeoffs. I just point to idiotic decisions and say the obvious. The way we evacuated Afghanistan was inexplicably incompetent. Biden, the SECDEF, and several generals should be tendering their resignations. Instead, they are asking for praise, and you are defending that crap.
I’m defending the truth. Partisan hypocrisy blinds even the most well intentioned from holding just accountability, regardless of party. Calling for certain resignations (when I assumed you didn’t do likewise for members of your party) is the sideshow here. You should be calling for a massive reduction in the power stolen by the Executive Branch. You should be calling for a paradigm shift in our foreign policy……one that doesn’t embolden terrorists and peer nations alike, weakening us from within. Further, the largest threat to what’s left of the Republic is from ourselves. Partisan division and rank hypocrisy is anti-American at its core.
Be biased in favor of truth as much as you are with regard to policy.
Yeah! If we just do everything your way, we won’t be hypocrites.
Have you ever played chess, checkers, or some other game that requires you to use your brain and apply logic. Military tactics and strategy requires the application of logic. What Biden chose to do logically — inevitably — put us in a far weaker position. All you babble does not address that. So, what you and Doug are saying is not relevant. Instead of discuss what Biden did, you are attacking his critics. You are just looking for excuses to avoid discussing what Biden did.
I’ll discuss what Biden did and did not do, all day long. The same goes for military tactics, theory and strategy.
You keep calling topics ‘sideshows’……..yet you continue to propagate lies about these sideshows. Why is that?
What each of the last four Administrations did, has weakened us, strategically….operationally….tactically and physiologically. But sure, go ahead and only blame those not in your party. Nah……that’s not hypocrisy at all……./sarc
@Constitutional Insurgent
Yeah! Instead of discussing the people we left behind, you will discuss the equipment.
When totalitarian regimes conduct massive genocides, they do what all people do when they commit shameful acts. They keep their activities secret from those with the capacity to criticize them. Sometimes they even get the cooperation of outfits like “The New York Times.” That outfit ignored Hitler’s Holocaust and Stalin’s murderous purges.
We don’t know how many people the Taliban are killing. We just know what they will most likely do, and the Biden administration wants us to believe they have changed. Meanwhile, you want to talk about anything else except the problem right in front of us.
I’ll discuss a lot of things Tom…I just won’t lie about them. Biden made a promise that he couldn’t possibly keep. But my sympathy for Americans who were warned to evacuate well ahead of time, as in months ahead of time….wanes.
I’ll keep debunking the lies about the equipment, as well s the “Biden ordered this, that and the other” as long as sock puppets keeping spewing them.
I’ll also continue to talk about our disastrous foreign policy decisions, where our actions have grown the terrorist and sympathizer base far beyond what bin Laden could have ever dreamed of, even after we played willingly right into his strategy.
I’ll also talk about who else we left behind…..our fallen warriors; our Veteran suicides; our Brothers and Sisters struggling with PTSD. But hey, we went in ans stayed for 20 years because of ‘good intentions’, right?
These are the problems right in front of us that I’ll talk about.
Will you?
@Constitutional Insurgent
Biden made it impossible to get people out.
With regard to American Citizens, most of them had months to get out.
@Constitutional Insurgent
You keep on pooh-poohing the fact Biden allowed a bunch of terrorists to take possession of tens of billions of dollars of military equipment. Oh! It was only 50, 40, or 20 billion dollars worth of equipment. It wasn’t 84 billion. I just think you have loss your mind. That idiot has gotten untold numbers of people killed.
You really have no clue about divestment and FMS, do you? Keep propagating lies. The narrative demands it.
I can tell you exactly how many American servicemembers have been killed in Afghanistan….it’s certainly not an untold number. Do they not count, because it doesn’t reinforce your narrative?
@Constitutional Insurgent
You are very selective in your use of facts. When the Biden administration was asked how many Americans had to be evacuated, their estimates were all over the place 10 to 15 thousand. Now they only left a couple hundred stranded.
They have no idea how many Afghans they needed to evacuate. Then there are the Christians……
Our military should have been the last out. They are armed, and they can protect themselves. Biden ordered them out first. First, he made the evacuation as dangerous and difficult as he could. Then he left people behind.
With respect to your first paragraph, I absolutely agree with you. now tell me where I’ve been unfactual.
I don’t care about the religious beliefs of anyone in, or evacuating Afghanistan. It doesn’t factor in.
Biden [or rather Gen McKenzie] ordered most of the forces out, but not all. Should they have left more, absolutely.
Do you not impart some amount of accountability on the American Citizens who could have – and should have, evacuated long before 30 August?
Upon reflection, it was unfair to ask you to tell me where I’ve been un-factual [unless you think I have been. I should have said, please tell me where I’ve been selective with the facts.
And you are sure of all that all by yourself, Tom? If that’s what an investigation reveals then so be it. I think I replied somewhere else that we got our 113,000 and the best estimates state there are maybe 150 to 200 Americans roaming that countryside… and even that is still a work in progress by the diplomats. That’s a 99.8% success rate if just measuring how many we got outta there. You’ve made a decision that he’s a traitor…. and you have NO idea what occurred behind the scenes given the unexpected changing circumstances over there.
@Doug
They just got out whoever could get pass the Taliban check points. There is no telling how many Americans the left behind, and they most certainly did not get out most of the Afghans the Taliban wants dead.
The “hate Biden-ists” are yakking about this “promise” Biden made that he would get everyone out of there.. and he failed his promise. You know.. I was watching live the broadcast when he made that promise and it was VERY obvious to me from the kind of promise that was, that it was going to be impossible to keep simply because no one seemed to have a grasp on the exact numbers needing to be evacuated. But the press was banging away at this issue “Are you going to get everyone out?” He had little option for encouraging answers and simply replying, “We will do the best we can.” wasn’t going to satisfy the press. I mean, I saw it perfectly that he wouldn’t be able to keep that promise. I even winced a bit knowing that in the moment he said it. So I am wondering what is so shocking? But again… the evacuation is not yet over so we shall see. But here’s the thing… no one knows how many there are left over there. So that’s way open ended that even if Biden declares “We finally got them all out.” there will still be one person left the press will dredge up that has this tearful story.
@Doug
Biden disbanded the team Trump had set up to plan the evacuation. Instead of planning anything, the Biden administration just pull our military out in the dark of night, and left everyone behind. Then, when people pointed out the problem, they had to send more troops back in, and they had to put them in a much weaker position dependent upon the TALIBAN for security. If our president is going to do something that utterly stupid, he may as well be working for the other side, and Biden probably is working for the other side.
The alternative being, that we could have had to conduct the evacuation under fire, regardless of how many units were in country.
@Constitutional Insurgent
We were under fire, and a bunch of people died. A bunch of people who should have been evacuated are dying even as we write.